Your Voice Is Betraying You (And You Don't Even Know It) | Hilary Blair

What if the biggest thing affecting your relationships, leadership, and communication isn't what you're saying...but how you're breathing?

In this episode, Anne sits down with speaker, facilitator, and communication expert Hilary Blair (hilaryblairspeaks.com), creator of the Fruitful Friction® framework, to explore the surprising connection between breath, voice, trust, and human connection. Drawing from decades in theater and corporate leadership development, Hilary reveals why your voice is a giant "poker tell" and how small shifts in breath and awareness can dramatically change the way people experience you. 

If you've ever struggled with difficult conversations, workplace conflict, executive presence, or feeling truly heard, this episode is packed with practical wisdom.

In This Episode, We Talk About:

•  Why your voice communicates trust before you even speak the words 
•  How breath affects confidence, connection, and emotional regulation 
•  The difference between being vulnerable and being available 
•  Why "take a deep breath" may be terrible advice...and what to do instead 
•  How tone, vowels, consonants, and vocal habits influence relationships 

Want more from Hilary?

• HilaryBlairSpeaks.com
• ArticulateRC.com

Hilary Blair is a dynamic speaker, facilitator and CEO of ARTiculate: Real&Clear. She’s the creator of Fruitful Friction®, a framework redefining tension as a catalyst for innovation, collaboration, and trust. Blending her background as a professional actor with deep expertise in communication and executive presence, Hilary helps leaders stay in conversation when it matters most. Her work equips teams to engage authentically, communicate clearly, and use friction to gain traction for growth.

Anne Bonney is a keynote speaker and emcee who helps organizations lead through change by building resilience, emotional intelligence, and courageous communication.

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:01

Hello, hello, hello, and welcome to Dancing in the Discomfort Zone podcast. My name is Ann Bonnie. I am your host, and I'm super excited to be here today during July 2026, Voice Month. After have being inspired by one of my other guests, I was like, let's just talk about voice the entire time. And so today I am thrilled to be welcoming Hilary Blair. She's a dynamic speaker, a facilitator, and the CEO of Articulate, Real and Clear. She's the creator of Fruitful Friction, which is one of my favorite things to say three times fast. But Fruitful Friction is actually a framework for redefining tension as a catalyst for innovation, collaboration, and trust. So, how do we use the friction in conflict in order to build that trust? She, her work equips teams to engage authentically, communicate clearly, and use friction to gain traction for growth. She's a drama teacher and she reportedly used to put the drama in, and now she helps take the drama out. Hillary, thank you so much for joining me today.

SPEAKER_00 1:09

A little friction. There we go. Let's go right.

SPEAKER_01 1:12

And how did you get into this work? I don't know much about your history. I mean, we know each other pretty well, but I don't know your acting history and how you end up here. So give us the Blair 2000.

SPEAKER_00 1:24

So I'll go with how I ended up working with business people, and then we can talk about how we ended up with fruitful friction, right? I love it. I have been doing training, teaching, Arts for Arts sake. So I've been in theater forever. I grew up in a children's theater that had us teach from a young age because they felt like teaching was how you learn, right? The craft, even better. And connected to that will be some voice. That's foreshadowing. We'll do more voice coming up. Yes, voice that will be happening. And uh so it through the years, and I would go and do summer stock and theater, and they'd always hear that I taught, and so I always ended up being a theater teacher. And I went for my MFA and acting, you know, that's the degree you get to make your parents feel safe and secure about your future. And I was always doing children's theater, among other things. I mean, I got trained in Shakespeare, you know, classically trained, and I have always loved theater for youth, always. And I've always I've always worked with youth, which is really the same as working with corporate. Again, we'll get to that more. So working with them, and I was in a beautiful three-hander, three-character play called Tomato Plant Girl. Tomato Plant Girl, bossy best friend, little girl, three characters. I was Tomato Plant Girl. I grew from the ground up, I grew into a large tomato, I became friends with little girl, helped her deal with bossy best friend. Life, right? Life right there.

SPEAKER_02 2:48

Love it.

SPEAKER_00 2:49

And when I was shaking my hands at the end of one of the performances, Little Hands, because I'm leaning down, I'm a giant red tomato. An adult walks past me and says, Hey, do you work with business people? And in my head, I'm thinking, I am a tomato at the moment. Out loud, I said, Yeah, some. She tucked her card into my costume and she said, Call me when you've worked with more. So when a visionary meets you and sees something that you don't see, your life shifts. Took about five months. I went back. I was working at the theater at that point, the Denver Center for the Performing Arts, and people would call and say, Do you work with business people? I said, Yes, you bet I do. I learned quickly the things you don't do with business people. Number one, have them lie down on the ground to breathe, right? That, you know, you just don't do that. That you have them stand up. So I learned how to do things differently. And five months later, I called her. I flew to New York City, I auditioned for her for her program. Count me in for women's economic independence in a competition called Make Mine a Million Dollar Business. She saw a tomato and thought she should coach people on their pitches. She saw that we brought stories to life, that we connected. I then spent the next seven years crisscross in the US being part of the team that was coaching the entrepreneurs on their pitches for the competition. And I had to work on a large chip on my shoulder because business people are horrible, money-grubbing humans, just horrible, right? And so I did. I chipped away, I fell in love with them, the business. I recognize they have the same passion and drive. They just happen to track and measure, which is helpful. I fell in love and then started my own company because of that. So I shifted to working with the corporate world, the business world, using the discipline of the performing arts and the idea that to be real and present in the moment takes practice and skill. It's easy to be fake, actually. What's harder is to be real and present. So that shift in bringing all of those tools and that framework, I have simply loved working with business people. I fell mad I've fallen madly in love with business people, and I love seeing the lights go on. I see them, I love seeing them start to use a little bit more of their body. I all of it, all of it to share their message.

SPEAKER_01 5:06

And how long ago was that uh that so that was probably 20 years ago.

SPEAKER_00 5:11

A little bit maybe a little bit more than that. And then took a little time, and then the business now officially have owned the business for 16 years.

SPEAKER_01 5:20

Nice. That's working.

SPEAKER_00 5:22

Yes, okay. Yeah. So roughly, yeah. So like yeah.

SPEAKER_02 5:26

In a year and a half.

SPEAKER_00 5:28

No, it's not. It we're still here. Lots of changes, lots of shifting with everyone, right? It's like how how do we share our gifts the best way we can? Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 5:37

Yeah. And and this month we're focusing on something I didn't think I was gonna focus on for a whole month, yeah, which is our voice and how we use our voice. And so, you know, as as I I have talked to you about performance art and you've corrected me or you've given me feedback on it, which I absolutely love. And so I was like, oh, this is perfect. So I want to start at the breath because as we talk about the use of our voice, our breath comes in. And one of the things you just said was we don't lay adults down on the ground to have them breathe. Why not? Right? I mean, they're breathing all the time anyway, right? Is it the laying on the ground part? What's I think it is.

SPEAKER_00 6:15

Their clothes were probably worth more than my salary. So that was part of the problem.

SPEAKER_01 6:20

Well, there's that.

SPEAKER_00 6:20

You know, there is that element to it. I think it's unnerving. I think that when you come from the theater world, there's so many things that are expected. You know you're gonna come in to the first graduate school class of, you know, on voice, and you know you just lay down, you know that's gonna happen. The whole idea of getting our breath and getting connected. And real nutshell, I learned to do things the opposite way. So in theater, we get connected to the ground, to our breath, to our bodies. We start making sound, we start standing up, we start making words and phrases, and then we go into dialogue and connection. We expect that because that's like the tradition of how we go. But business people come with, for one, in urgency, we need to get this done quickly. They come with a speech, they know what they want to say, and my job is to get them curious to move backwards. So, my favorite thing is we, you know, we work on the script and then they're like, oh, how do I connect that to my breath? And oh yeah, and hear some voice things, and then what about the sounds? Why do I choose the different words that I choose? Because words have different impact. There's a difference between an you know, architecture and a house, right? There are different sounds going on there, or a bunny and a rabbit. So there are different things with words.

SPEAKER_02 7:32

I was about to say, why is this important? You totally just illustrated it with two words, bunny and rabbit. You're like, bunny, I'm like, yeah, bunny. And then you're like, rabbit. I'm like, wait, what? You just illustrated it all. I love it. Anyway, sorry, keep going this way.

SPEAKER_00 7:46

So all those words matter, and then you have, and then you get them. When my favorite thing is at the end when they say, I think I should work on voice, and I'm like, oh yeah, that's a cool idea. I mean, when I spotted it, I wanted people to work on voice first because it seems foundational. People want to work on things in the order of their curiosity, not in the order that I think they should. Right. And that's with messaging and everything. So we kind of work in reverse. Yeah. Work on the message and then yeah. So that's my journey working with business people, whether we're coaching or doing groups or keynoting or whatever it is. Yes.

SPEAKER_01 8:18

Yeah, I love it. I love it. So, I mean, as much as I said you just illustrated, and I'd like you to go through it a little bit more specifically. Why does the way we use our voice matter? Yes, the words are important. Uh the way we send our message is important, but the way we use our instrument is also important. So talk a little bit about that.

SPEAKER_00 8:37

We are a stereo, right? So we have, right, we have our warm sounds and we have our clarity. And many of us, when nerves come in, nerves will always come in, they usually interrupt breath. And breath is the sole thing that powers our voice. So if our breath is interrupted, we are not sharing our full selves, right? We're getting tight, we're not having it all come out. So, for instance, if I you ask me a question and I'm not sure about the answer, I might oh go, oh yeah, right. Uh, just a second. Like all of a sudden I'm here, right? And because I have a higher voice, I've just removed the lower register, I've removed the warmth so it sounds higher. I haven't actually gone higher. I have simply removed the breath flow so it gets a little tight. Oh, and then if I even went tighter, it gets shrill, right? The thing is, with that treble with a higher voice, you can understand me. There's a clarity to my speech, but it's lacks the warmth. Some people default the other way. Now I'm simplifying this. When they get nervous, when they they more kind of go down here and they kind of just do the what I call the rumble voice. And the interesting thing is the rumble voice, we love. And then we ask, can you understand them? No, but I love it. It feels like bathing in shit, right?

SPEAKER_01 9:54

But it's not understandable.

SPEAKER_00 9:56

So we want both. We want a stereo, we want the warmth for the we want the lower register for warmth, and we want the treble, it was a bass for warmth, treble for clarity. And when our voice is in stereo, it connects more easily to others. Two more things. One is that we want to make sure we have the music of our voice, the P-R-O-S-O-D-Y, prosody, the prosody of the voice. That's the term for the inflection intonation, rhythm, all of that, which means that if you're reading to a child, it comes naturally. All right, and then they win into the dark forest. For some reason, though, right? If we don't do that, a little kid will be like, come on, pull it up, pull it up, what's going on? But if I go after you, right, and I said, we should really do this next project and make this step happen, or we'll be going into the dark problem. Right? So it helps them understand where we are. We've edited it, edited it, because it doesn't seem professional. So music of our voice has gotten removed because monotone removes a lot of emotional quality, and we assume we're not oversharing in a way that lets people see in too much to what's going on. So we have our stereo, we have the fact that we want to have music, it helps. And we can talk about consonants and vowels. I'll share about that in just a second. But the third element, along with stereo, allowing ourselves to have the music to allow us to realize that the bunny is different than the rabbit. All of that, and architecture is different than, you know, a pencil sketch. So all of these things, all of the different fun language, is that many of us get our voice trapped inside our mouth and inside our throat. So we will say that the power source are the lungs, right? Air comes from the lungs, goes through the vocal folds, the vocal cords, they shape into sound and we share our voice out here. So it comes up and out like that. Many of us get either nervous or we've drunk coffee or we've eat had onions. So it can be either physiological or psychological. Yes. And then I'm like, if I'm if I'm actually in a space with you, and I'll be like, yeah, I don't want to really talk about, I don't want to breathe on you. So I kind of speak inside. It's like I'm recycling my own voice. I'm not sharing it out. It's right here. And this tight voice is a very common thing, especially if you have coffee or onions, right? We'll go there. My voice is higher, so it has a different tone to it, right? I mean, a different kind of uh feel to it. The idea, though, is that we want it to flow out. So voice takes place outside the body, out here. That's where my voice is. I'm sharing it out. The breath comes through and I share it here. When we hold it in, it changes trust building, connection, feeling like I'm in relationship. Granted, there is the spit problem. You know, actors on stage are like spits flying, you know, that does, there is that element, right? And so there are other reasons why we're careful and that kind of thing. The main thing though is we want to make sure our voice, because it's breath, our voice rides on the exhale. Air, we shape it and we share it out here. That's what we want to make sure is we are sharing our breath outside our body instead of inside. Or if we're doing it inside, just notice it, go, look at me. I'm not really sharing my voice. Hi, Ann. I'm gonna have my voice come out versus hi Ann. Hi, I have a tight end here. And I have not met anyone who doesn't do all of these vocal, all these vocal habit shifts. We all do them. We all vocal, I shouldn't say all, most of us vocal fry or talk inside our mouths or do a variety of things because we're human beings and our voice rides on our breath, and our breath is who we are and what we're sharing. So we edit it all the time.

SPEAKER_01 13:47

Of course.

SPEAKER_00 13:48

Out of fear and things, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 13:50

Well, and all of this is subconscious, not only the changing of it in our mouths and in our head and before it comes out to share with the world, but also the analysis of it on the other side is also subconscious. Unless you study this, you know, you're not going, oh, well, her voice is feeling like it's not coming out, and the, you know, maybe she's caring what about onions. No, all I know is there's just something about this person I don't trust.

SPEAKER_00 14:16

Right. So it's very, it is strongly connected to trust because breath matters. And that because of breath is who we are and our our inspiration and sharing it on the exhale, and editing in my mind, like, what's the most helpful thing? Because what happens is most of us will say, Well, everybody, of course, Taylor, we know that. Breathe without diaphragm and take a big breath. And I'm like, those are the two worst pieces of advice. Worst. Those are the two worst pieces of advice. And I'm a voice teacher and I have given those. I have given them many, many times. Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. Take a deep breath. Is when we take a deep breath. It usually means that we're overriding our the way our the physiology of our body works, and we're overriding the instinct. The way our body works is when, like you just went, huh? Right? You didn't go, you went exhale. What? Hillary, what? You exhaled. We exhale to reset. Huh, right. Uh whatever it is, we sigh, we do all kinds of sounds out because we need the air out. Exhale is intentional, inhale is reflexive. So if we get the air out, we fill more deeply into our lungs. So those of us who've been telling you, including me, to take a deep breath, if you do it with me right now, we'll probably do this. Anybody out there listening, we'll go, take a deep breath, we'll go like this. Which is a shallow breath. It's a high clavicular, shallow breath. If I suggest, and Bonnie, that you just exhale, just say, I'm exhaling all my air. Say that, I'm exhaling all my air.

SPEAKER_01 15:53

Exhaling all my air.

SPEAKER_00 15:55

And then you're it's already back in. You don't have to worry about inhaling because we just exhale and then it comes back in. Here's a way to test it, everyone. Just say, I'm exhaling my air, I'm exhaling my air, I'm exhaling my air. Say it three times and allow the air back in between.

SPEAKER_01 16:11

I'm exhaling my air. I'm exhaling. Oh, it just happens. I'm exhaling my air. Yes. I'm exhale. I mean, that's how I made it happen, but yeah, I mean it's you're inhale. The inhale just happens.

SPEAKER_00 16:24

It's reflexive, yes. And so that's why as a runner, I was trained to exhale. I wasn't running like this, right? I was running. Speaking, any sound, 99.9% of the time, when we create a sound, it's on the exhale. Air comes through vocal folds, creates vibration, we shape it out here. So speaking is the exhale, which is why many of us we think the filler words are only because we're trying to hold the space. Many times our filler words are because we're trying to get the air out without realizing it. So if we can intentionally use our exhale, right. Give me a moment. Good question. Hang on. Any of those are a proper exhale that helps us get the breath back in. Versus you ask me a scary question, I go and then I try and breathe in, and I have no air. And without that air in my lungs coming through, I can't share it. So back to your really original question: why does it matter? Because our breath is who we are, and our voice is a total poker tell on what's going on with us. So, yeah, someone like me, overtrained, I don't turn it on all the time. I had a beautiful coach early on, Gary Logan, early on, who taught us how to turn it off so we could enjoy theater and movies and things, right? So I don't turn it on all the time. When it is on, though, I am picking up on. I am picking up on things and what's going on. Doesn't mean I'm right about the story I attach. I may be right about the physiology. I'm not necessarily right about the story. We need to separate facts from a story.

SPEAKER_01 17:59

And that's a fascinating piece of that. But the ultimate lesson here is that people are making stories, consciously or unconsciously. Have to how your br how your breath is coming out with noise with it is creating stories in the other person's mind. And so being able to bring in that warmth, being able to bring in that freedom of breath is more likely to even subconsciously, nobody knows what the heck's going on, build more trust with people.

SPEAKER_00 18:27

Right. In mirror neurons. So the more I do it, you will reflexively go, you will, in response, go there as well. So we don't trust mirror neurons enough to recognize if I'm breathing, right? I trained as a drama teacher. They didn't say mirror neurons a hundred years ago when I trained as a drama teacher. But when we trained as a drama teacher, we'll stand in a circle and keep our arms open, right? And I wouldn't ask people to uncross their arms. I would simply model being open, right? And allowing when they were ready, right, to drop that. It happens in conversations, it happens in so many things, those mirror neurons. And so trusting that if you allow that voice, I mean, Anne, you do it. You, I mean, I'm gonna, I'm gonna like simplify it. You, whether on the platform or meeting you in person, you fill a large space with your joy and your beingness, which invites me to share a large space with my voice and my beingness. Some of us are taught that in order to let people fill a space, I should shrink myself. It that doesn't make you feel more able to take up space. You're showing me, whether mirror neurons are modeling, that I can be big. And you do that for me too, just so you know everyone, and does that for me as well as I know she does it for many of you. She helps me be, take up space, yes, and show up fully, right? So that mirror neuron, let's not underestimate the power of my voice matters. Now I can also go to a managed voice, which then gets irritating.

SPEAKER_01 19:56

Wow, I immediately got nauseous. Like I was like, wow, I don't like that.

SPEAKER_00 20:01

Yeah, so that was that doesn't have the authenticity of the voice and the balance, right? It could be fun if I were doing a character, right? If you saw a little animated character, hello, let's figure out how many puppies have spots, right? So you would know, right? I mean, we're already going to 101 domains. We might go to a different voice, right? A different character.

unknown 20:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 20:20

Yes. I am not a, I am I am trained specifically to help people de-gunk to find their own authentic voice. That and we also have multiple voices. We are not one person. We are multifaceted, truthfully multifaceted. We have many ways of showing up. So I'm not helping them find the one voice that's them. I'm not. I am helping them find the many voices that are them.

SPEAKER_01 20:43

Right. Yes.

SPEAKER_00 20:44

Right.

SPEAKER_01 20:45

So taking this to the workplace, taking this to our lives, right? And we're, you know, most of us that are probably listening are not gonna be stage actors, and we can still use this to great benefit in our lives, in our conflict, especially. Talk a little bit about using it when things get a little sticky. Or as you say, there's friction and we want to make it fruitful.

SPEAKER_00 21:08

Yeah. So that idea of separating friction from conflict, uh, we say friction is inevitable, conflict isn't. So that idea of having ideas that rub off of each other, right? And there's a great book. The author's name is missing right now, but it's friction, a biography. It's a woman who wrote the science of friction and that it's essential to life. And I am connecting, right? That that our whole planet is based on friction as part of how our world operates. It's how we stay on the planet and all of that. So friction has gotten a bad rap.

SPEAKER_01 21:37

So we stay on the planet. That's right. Good old gravity, create friction. Totally, right? We need it. We do need that. That's important.

SPEAKER_00 21:46

And we have this sort of overemphasis on smoothing things over. And we want to have that friction because that's where we invite different ideas in. We want the different ideas. I've been at many a table in a room with you, Anne, where different. Different ideas were coming in, and we created what we call a messy middleware. Yes, oh god it. Oh, interesting. It doesn't mean we don't have reactions to the things. We understand, though, whether we're invited to be in the conversation or whether we find ourselves retreating behind a void or attack. So the classic places for us to go are a void or attack because we haven't really been given the tools to stay in the conversation and stay present with each other. And our world needs that. So as far as voice goes, one of the key places that you had that feeling when I went to this one, right? That managed voice. Because then I'm behind the voice. Me, Hillary, I'm behind the voice. I'm not actually in it with you. And if we go here, yeah, I'm good. Why, Ann? What did you want to know about? Yeah, I'm good. Right? We go there, and if we were in the middle of a conversation or we were working together, you might not even notice the slow shift into that tightening thing. Your body will start to feel protective, though, right? You might not go, oh, Hillary's now talking with her upper register from a tighter voice, her flow is her breath isn't flowing. You would, your body would be like, why is she defensive or protective, right?

SPEAKER_03 23:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 23:08

Or it might be a shift in tone. Yeah, I'm good. Why? Which generally comes with just using consonants and editing out the vowels. So the consonants are the intellectual content and the vowels are the emotional content. So if we can make sure that we're using both, it can help. So if I'm recognizing that I'm frustrated, if I'm saying, okay, I want to, and I want to hang on, I want to connect. So transparency is a great tool. And using my voice, getting back on the vowel and go, okay, I'm here, versus, yeah, okay, let's talk it out. You're like, I don't think she's ready to talk out. And if I want to be transparent, I could be like, okay, I can still feel I'm feeling tight and defensive. I still want to talk it out. I'm here. So then I'm overriding the fact that my body is feeling one thing and I know I'm sending mixed messages. So I let you know that. I go, I got it. I really do. I do want to, I do want to have this conversation. Let me see if I can get my breath back. Okay, it's coming. You know, whatever that is. So vowels and consonants, the idea of breath, we're modeling it, and then transparency is a huge help in working on our communication. So you have to have self-awareness though, for transparency.

SPEAKER_01 24:14

Transparency being sharing information.

SPEAKER_00 24:17

Is that what you mean by sharing what's going on with me?

SPEAKER_01 24:21

Ah, transparency of my my like I'm feeling uncomfortable right now. I totally want to have this conversation. I know I'm sounding a little bit, yeah, okay.

SPEAKER_00 24:29

And it also could be where you are. I totally want to have this conversation. I'm realizing I'm in the hall at a conference and I'm not as, you know, because you wouldn't know, right? Where am I? What's going on? You might not know. Or, hey, someone just entered the room, let them exit and then I'll finish our conversation. So there's transparency of situation as well. Well, I love that.

SPEAKER_01 24:47

I think that's so important to be able to share where you are and the intent behind, you know, like I really want to have this conversation, and I'm in the hallway in a hotel and the sessions are about to let out, and the 300 people are about to walk, you know, or you know, and I'm not in a place where I can uh talk about this right now. Or, you know, I just I need to have a sandwich. You know, I can hold it together.

SPEAKER_00 25:12

So yes, yes, I love that. I love that. I'm hungry. Yeah, I got the hangries coming on, and yes, wherever that is. Yeah, yeah. And you said something which is um I want to just point out because I'm all about the little things are a big deal. So we can't argue intent, right? I can't argue intent. I can mention intent, right? So I want to make sure. So I can't say, well, I meant, I didn't mean to hurt you. Yeah, but you did, right? So I didn't want to offend you, right? So we have to make sure, and the best place to practice that is home, of course. The loved one in our correct orbit. We kind of do all the bad habits with the loved ones. And so that idea of we so I wanted to make sure what you were saying is I'm sharing my intent without saying using it as an excuse. So there are different, there's a difference between sharing that in an excuse way and just letting a clarifying way. Just want to make sure that's a little distinction and important.

SPEAKER_01 26:08

Well, and it's a huge distinction I make a lot in emotional intelligence training is separating your intent from the impact. Being able to say the impact of that was not what I intended.

SPEAKER_03 26:19

Great.

SPEAKER_01 26:19

Doesn't it's not an excuse. Here's what my intention was, right? And I'm also understanding how it landed.

SPEAKER_00 26:24

And I'll work on my impact so it's better. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:27

Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_00 26:27

Your toe was there. I did step on it. That wasn't my intention. Right. And I will avoid stepping on your toe in the future.

SPEAKER_01 26:36

I'll avoid the other nine going forward. Try. Yes.

SPEAKER_00 26:39

Yes. So the fruitful friction has been a beautiful journey for me because in my decades of working with people on communication, I was, and it's always been about relationship, right? Communication, executive presence, presence, leadership presence, all that voice, all of these things, whether it's public speaking, presentation, all of it about how do I be in relationship with the other person. And I wanted to share with you that it was a client who came up with the word friction that we're dealing with right now. So I was working with a group, two groups that were not getting along, project managers and sales folks for a very high-level uh AI company, and they were just here, they were not communicating well at all. I was brought in, I did a a day workshop using improv and other techniques that I use for communication. And I always joke the requisite empty pizza boxes were in the corner, right? So workshop done, right? And this guy comes across with full attitude right at me. And I I look up and he goes, Hallory, I thought you were gonna have us get along. And instead, you got us comfortable with friction. And I was like, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, fireworks. I go, that's exactly what it is. I'm like, oh my gosh, that's so great. And that adjustment, right? So they moved their desks next to each other the next day. Because they didn't have to like get along and like each other, they had to work together, right? And friction was okay, and friction was probably really good for them, right? It's like, what are the ideas? So I just love that it came from a client, and then the idea that all the tools I've been using my whole life, voice, the idea of public speaking presentation, all of it is about how do we stay in conversation? How do we expand the messy middle so that we have fruitful friction and traction instead of defaulting to conflict or avoiding? Or conflict. I get pretty passionate. I get pretty I love it.

SPEAKER_01 28:34

I love it. Well, I think it's such an important thing for us to get good at because we're not good at it. It's our brains are not built to do this naturally. So I want a case study, and I don't do this typically, but I'm sitting here going, okay, I'm sitting here thinking about somebody in the audience who's going, I need to figure out how to talk to that person in the office who drives me nuts. Everything they say, I can't. And and oftentimes what I always do for myself in those moments is say, okay, what can I do differently to maybe get different results from this person? And so, how does voice play in when somebody is annoying us? I know we all talk about, I talk about the billboard face, right? If I'm feeling it, you're gonna see it on the face. But our voice can also do that in the way we're communicating and the way we're using our voice to communicate with that person that we those feelings about.

SPEAKER_00 29:25

Yep.

SPEAKER_01 29:25

How can we manage our tone and our all of the things without becoming that managed, that feel, that managed voice that you use that felt, oh Hillary, well, I see your challenge. Thank you. I'd like to talk about this when you have a moment. Like we don't want to go there, right? But how do I get the angst out so that I have a better chance at communicating with that person?

SPEAKER_00 29:56

First, I want to remind uh all of us, and I know we know it, that we really do read voices. And when we forget that, I just have you think about anyone that you love dearly calling you on the phone. So they call you on the phone. I don't know if anybody uses phones anymore. But if anybody calls you on a phone, they call you, and let's say I'm your dear friend. Okay, I'm just gonna have to do it really quickly because I want to remind people that it you really can tell the difference. So I'm a dear friend, you're calling me on the phone, and you say, just say, Hey Hillary, what's up? Just ask me, hey Hillary, what's up?

SPEAKER_02 30:29

Hey Hillary, what's up?

SPEAKER_00 30:31

Not much. Oh you're gonna immediately say, ask me, what's wrong? What's wrong, right? Yeah, not much. Nothing's up, right? So then you're gonna just ask me the same question again. Just ask me the same exact question again. Still a good friend. Here we go.

SPEAKER_02 30:46

Hey Hillary, what's up?

SPEAKER_00 30:47

Not much. So I know you're seeing my face, but also just hearing, and it's the podcast too, hearing it. So not much. I don't have much going on. I'm just like, here it is, I got the vowels and all that. We make instant decisions about people's state of mind and state of being, worth and value based on voices. It's huge. Immediately. It's why we when you know, you'll like it's so anyone out there with teenagers, we often use teenagers for this example, we have teenagers, and it's not what they said, it's the tone you heard before they like they just started to speak, you already know you're irritated at their response, right? You're like, so they say it's a long, there's a lot of time between the beginning of a tone and the words being spoken. It's not, it is in the science world, but not in our world, right? But it's a fraction of a moment, fraction of a second. In that second, we have already decided how people are responding to us. So if we go to what you're saying, it doesn't even really matter how much we practice what we're gonna say. We does matter, it does. But more importantly, we have to be aware of what you said, which is I would say being in touch with, managing the idea of being in touch with versus manipulating. And all the words are fine, right? I want to be careful. Words create worlds so we all respond differently to them. So the idea of understanding that our tone and our breath will be received by the person on the other end before we even use any words. So it comes back to the transparency. And I can I can already tell that I I just have a little bit of, I can feel, I have a little bit of oomph going on. I want you to know I can tell that. I really want to have, I want to have this conversation. Now, here's the thing: I don't want to say I'm pissed still or any of the words. I don't even can I say that on your podcast? So um I don't want to I don't know. So words, I'm sorry about that. So I don't want to use language that's triggering, because even the word trigger is triggering just FYI. So I'm looking for something that owns how I'm feeling without trying to label it as something. And it gives you that space to recognize I know how I'm coming across. One of the biggest leadership problems is we think we are better poker players or blank billboard people than we are. And so what happens is the trust is immediately challenged, not just undermined, but challenged. Because if I'm like, hey, yeah, I'm good, I want to talk to you, Ann, about what's going on, all right? So I'm like, okay, so I'm managing my breath, I'm holding there, I'm trying to keep it pleasant, and I can do a lot of things with my voice that just because of a lot of a practice, right? I've been a voiceover actor for a long time, right? So that sense of where I am, and you immediately feel when it's slightly held, you're more responding to the fact that it's held, breath is held. So I'm thinking that I'm being really open and connected. And what happens is whether I'm already feeling better or whether I really am feeling these things, you're putting a story on what's physiologically happening to me. So your story may not be in alignment with what I'm feeling. At least by telling you what's going on with me, I'm helping, I'm a step towards clarifying what's happening. So if I say, Oh, I can still, I'm a little tense, I can tell I'm a little tense, I want you to know that. Then you know that I know myself. The best thing to hear from a leader is they have self-awareness. How beautiful is that? Most of us think, yeah, tell me, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 34:16

Well, plus I feel like by saying that, I'm kind of naming the elephant in the room of like, we're both uncomfortable, we know this. We don't like each other. You know, we don't get along. Like, I'm kind of naming the thing. And that kind of like it's sort of extending that.

SPEAKER_00 34:31

And I can talk to my half of it, which I know you know, right? Because I can claim where I am. Yeah. And then I'm not thinking what happens, I think that leaders, right? Tell me you're you do this work, that leaders, me being a leader too, right? We were thinking, I'm all good, so I'm just gonna be here. I don't want to burden them with that. I don't want to go there. I'm gonna, it's gonna waste time. We think so many things are a waste of time, oversharing, and that people aren't picking up on it. That has to, we are human beings. We are picking up on stuff all the time. And if we aren't clear about it, then we're gonna create misinformation, misguided, misinterpretation, which then all the miscommunication happens. So, to your point of how do we use our voice for going in, the number one thing is that transparency and keeping the breath going. Here's the thing we hold our breath in order to not cry and to not explode, which is completely counterintuitive with what the body needs. The body needs you to exhale. So when I teach people who are about to give a uh talk at a at a funeral or something that has some emotion to it, the main thing I have one guy he wanted to ask for his future father-in-law's daughter, like he wanted to ask for her hand in marriage, and he kept crying, and I go, we'll work on that. So, right, so the main thing, he was so sweet, he goes, I don't want to cry in front of him. And I go, probably endearing. I get why not? So that idea, right? And it's probably great. So that sense of if we breathe, crying happens at held breath. So if we breathe, if we are consciously aware that we need to exhale, we need to allow the air back in, we can stay present, whether it's in a talk, whether it's something going on. Same with anger, right? So anger and tears are really close together. I'm debating whether I do this silly thing for you. It's Ann, it's your podcast. Are you ready for a silly thing?

SPEAKER_03 36:22

Yes!

SPEAKER_00 36:23

You can do this with me, folks, wherever you're listening to this, do this with me. So a way to experience that is we want to notice, I'm gonna take one step back. So if a little kid cries, right? And they're like, they take a breath and they go, yeah, you're like, so fake. So fake, right? If on the other hand, so I exhaled all my air and then I just did little taps of sound, that's a cry. That's where we are, right? So when we are at the end of breath and we cry, that's what happens with us. Now, the thing, the reason why anger and laughter and tears are all connected is all I have to do is change my mouth and you will hear something different, and I will feel something different. So if I exhale, and you can do this with me, turn the corner of your mouth down and then tap a little sound. And so if you just do it's why people laugh at funerals, right? It's totally, it's they're so connected.

SPEAKER_02 37:28

Same thing. Totally, different mouth shape.

SPEAKER_00 37:32

Totally. So where we are, and it changes how you experience it in your body. And then anger and frustration is connected there too. Right? It's all connected, they're all living really close together, and they're living at the end of breath. So when we allow breath back in, we can ground ourselves. I know that's an actory term. Ground ourselves, right? That sense of being here. Let me just get a breath together, let me organize myself. It's why we sigh out. Right. Now I'm an actor. I make sounds that don't have words connected to them. Ha ha. When I invite groups that I'm working with to do that, they all look at me like and I go, I know. It already is pushing the envelope of comfort. So Anne Bonnie makes some sounds. Let it fall out. It's weird, right? It feels weird. It is. It's weird. And Anne, I want to point out to your audience that they would normally think that was easy for you because you live in the big space. And the reason I want you to be uncomfortable to notice you're uncomfortable as well is to have grace for yourself. We have to understand that when we talk about breath and our voices and connecting with people, it's incredibly open. I s I talk about the difference between available and vulnerable. So available means that we choose what we do and don't share. Vulnerable is kind of like here it all is. Vulnerable is important for us to talk to ourselves. Available is an important thing when we're sharing our voice and talking to our employees. So available means I'm still real and present, but there are certain things that I keep behind a boundary. Walls versus boundaries. It's a whole other thing, right? The idea is I'm trying to keep my walls down. I want to talk to you, but I have plenty of stuff that's behind the boundary. Like some of the things behind the boundaries you need to know might be simply I can't talk about the finances with you, or I can't talk about what that other person said. Those are behind there. I still want the wall down and I want to be present. So that connects to my breath and my voice. I still want to talk to you. I, you know, I don't even have to tell you I'm not sharing everything, though that might be a transparency. And I can't talk about all of the numbers. I still want to be present with you. So the idea of distinguishing, distinguishing between walls and boundaries can be really helpful as a leader with your team and really connected to what I'm sharing vocally and how I'm showing up. So if we go back to that irritating person, you're my person, and totally irritating. I'm sure this isn't the first time. All kinds of things going on. And yeah, and we get to decide where we are. I want to have a talk. I can tell I'm tense. I just want you to know I still want to have it. And I want to make sure, yeah, that of course that I'm staying respectful. I can only say me, not us. I can't say I want us both through, I can only do me, right? I want to be respectful and connected here, and I can tell that I have, I can feel a little edge in my voice. I want you to know I'm aware of that, right? I want us to talk this out. Can be really helpful and transparent. Now I kind of went to precious voice just then. Don't do precious voice. Precious voice is when you push extra breath through to emphasize something. Usually lands as preschool. Don't do it. Don't go there. Don't do what I just did. We all do all of these things. It's like, yeah, so I push it through, and I really care. And you'll be like, Really?

SPEAKER_03 40:54

I don't think I care about you two.

SPEAKER_00 40:57

Being aligned and being really fully on breath, as I've said to you, and on voice. Well, super challenging.

SPEAKER_01 41:04

Yeah. Well, and all of this so carefully connects to being present and being having an understanding of why I'm there. Why do I want to have that conversation? Why do I want to make this investment in the future of this relationship with this person? Yes. And when I have that understanding, I can be present in the moment right now, not present in the moment when they interrupted me in front of the client. Not present, you know, three or three weeks ago when they didn't do the thing they said they were going to do, you know, or whatever. But being totally in the now and saying, this is what I want to do for our future and being present in all of that. And then it's easier to bring that.

SPEAKER_00 41:45

Yeah. And when you I want to talk about that incident that happened two weeks ago when you interrupted me, I realize you can hear my voice. I can hear my voice. I don't know if you're hearing, I can feel it already getting so I want to breathe into that, and I I can feel I'm having a lot of feels. I want to, and then you would go to your other stuff, the hows and the what's, not the whys, you know, all the stuff, like all the stuff we know to do with conversations. That's the messy middle. Like, so my feeling about when we talk about fruitful friction, getting traction, the voice being a huge part of that. You can use any of the tools. We're all trained in so many tools. I want you to pull all those tools in. I'm not suggesting that we have the right tools. What we're saying is how do we activate the tools? How do we stay present on our voice, activate what you've been trained in, whatever feedback model, all those different things. You you need to be present on your breath and transparent. Those are the two key things. And that idea of staying here instead of resorting to avoid or attack. And if you do resort to avoid or attack, which we all do, it's like a video game. Just push a button and come back. Or go, I think I'm behind a wall. I think I'm over here. Yeah, whatever it might be. Or you leave the room and go, wow, I did that. Yeah. So I I'm I I digress. You know, I think in a starburst, my friend. I think like that and come back.

SPEAKER_01 43:03

Well, no, it's fun. I love it because all of the little blasts of the Starburst are valuable. But in the end of the day, I think what you just said was the fact that all of the tactics and frameworks and right words and all that go out the window. If our voice is betraying us, if we're coming in with precious voice, if we're coming in with an edge, like, okay, Hillary, let's talk about this. I'm gonna talk about it and I'm gonna be vulnerable. Not like you're like, yeah, no. But you know, so we can learn all these tactics, but our voice will betray us in that trust, even if we're doing everything else right, if we're not willing to connect, because that can betrays a different thing going on inside.

SPEAKER_00 43:43

I'm I'm sitting here going, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yes. And I want to also say, I know the tools are good, I know all that. And I totally, totally it comes back to me saying, I totally think we forget to get coached on how so how to use the tools. What I'll say is there are tools, there are skills to Use the tools, and then there's finesse to the skill. And so we want to make sure if the tool is uh think of a feedback model, I don't know, whatever, or whatever it might be, whatever's that tool, like the feedback model, right? Then the skill is how do I use that feedback model when I'm under pressure and all that. Then finesse is being aware of me with the skill for the tool. What happens is we tend to hand people tools and expect them, right, to be able to use it. And it's sort of somehow how I say it is a little bit like the Etsy, if you or Etsy or um Pinterest, Pinterest. If you go on Pinterest and you see like this beautiful cake that someone made for their five-year-old child or niece or nephew or whatever, right? Five-year-old, right? And it's got a fire engine, it's amazing. And then you get the skills to do it, but the finesse that made that picture worthy on Pinterest, that's the same thing in human connection. How do I practice that finesse? And here's the other thing, Ann, Bonnie, is that feedback the people we usually think are great at feedback are people from our past who we think of, like a coach, a choir director, a theater director, right? All of those. The reason they were good at what they do is because they were good at feedback. All right. So we then put people in these positions where they're being hired to do all these different roles, AI, whatever the things are, and they have to give feedback as part of their job. It doesn't mean that giving feedback was part of their job description at the beginning, right? So that's their skill set. Yes, their skill set. And so that idea of we we can sometimes compare ourselves to like, I don't know, the wrong people, if that makes any sense. Like the people that, yeah. So I want to make sure that we're aware that the the whole concept of being in the messy middle and using those tools and what's going on changes dramatically depending on who the person across from us is. Someone we have a history with that's a little harder, right? Than a client who's just irritating, right? Whatever it might be, right? Then it's easier, like, oh, I got this down. I just used my tools really well with the client, I'm staying on voice. And then it's like my colleague who right, so it changes.

unknown 46:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 46:15

All the power dynamic shifts, all kinds of things shift. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 46:19

Yeah. Yeah. Oh, I love it. There's so much juice here to squeeze. If people are more interested in getting more information about Hillary Blair and fruitful friction, I have to pause before I say it because I don't want it to come out wrong. Um, where can they find you?

SPEAKER_00 46:36

Hilary Blair speaks. That's easy. Hillary Blair, find me one L. You know, my dad always said, why use two when one would work? So Hillary Blair on LinkedIn, helpful. And then our training company is articulatorc.com. The R and C stand for real and clear. Again, from a client. Articulate, getting people real and clear. So articulate RC. I love talking to people. I love answering questions. I love all of it. So if you please challenge me, and I you'll hear something that I said that Ann and I were going on about, and you're like, well, I don't know if I agree with that. Please let me know, right? I dropped the bomb of like, you know, diaphragmatic breathing is one of the worst pieces of advice, and we never followed up on that. So ask me about it. Absolutely. I don't need to now, but Anne, right? I get so excited talking about it. Thank you.

SPEAKER_01 47:25

I love it. Well, I'll put all of those links in the show notes so that you can just go and click and find Hillary and ask her about diaphragmatic breathing. Uh, in opera singing, I know it is very helpful, but this is not what we're talking about.

SPEAKER_00 47:36

No, it is it is helpful. Yes, it is helpful. It is actually not even helpful. You can't not do it as long as you're not paralyzed. Diaphromatic breathing is how we breathe.

SPEAKER_01 47:46

It's just what you do. On that note, thank you, Hilary. You're awesome. It's always a pleasure. And uh, I know people are gonna get in touch.

SPEAKER_00 47:57

Bye. Thank you.